Our Zoom call this week, for paid subscribers, will be on Thursday (not our regular Friday) at Noon EDT. Our guest will be Aparna Gopalan, news editor of Jewish Currents, and author of the important new investigation, “The Hindu Nationalists Using the Pro-Israel Playbook
It's nice to see Beinart dealing with reality for a change. What we often hear from Palestinian apologists is if the two state solution dies or becomes infeasible, a "one state solution" is the only inevitable result. But this is not true, as Beinart admits in this column.
But there is yet another option, one that Beinart didn't think of, which is the Jordanian option:
Regarding mass expulsions from the West Bank, although this is certainly undesirable, it's not unprecedented as a way of resolving conflicts. Israel and Palestine were not the only example in history of a partition and resulting population transfer. India and Pakistan's creations led to a million dead and many more forced to leave their homes. And of course millions of Germans were expelled from their homes at the end of World War II.
Let's also not forget that the pro-Palestinian activist class are insistent that all 500,000 Israeli settlers be expelled, and of course are big proponents of the "right of return" which would involve 10 million Palestinians leaving their homes and going to Israel. So the idea of mass movement as a prerequisite to end the conflict isn't unprecedented or even undesirable, at least according to Amnesty International, who calls for every settler to be removed from the West Bank.
The real issue, the one that Beinart can't talk about, is that the Palestinians do not want peace with Israel under any circumstances and under any conditions. That's why the Second Intifada "broke out" (aka planned and executed by Arafat so he could maintain his legitimacy after signing the Oslo Accords, any move towards peace with the Yahud makes Palestinian leaders lose legitimacy in the eyes of their people). Let us all hope the Palestinian leadership finally chooses peace and human rights over war and terrorism. The Palestinians have much more to lose from the death of the two state solution than the Israelis.
Peter writes this whole column, and never talks about the elephant in the room: The complete and total refusal by Palestine to live in peace with Israel. Notice that he never gives any agency to any Palestinians in this article. They are never responsible for their own fate and situation, all they do is just live under the conditions imposed on them by Israel and react accordingly.
Israel is faced with a hostile nation, Palestine, that has trained its people for generations at this point to hate Israel and Israelis and Jews. Its only aspiration in life is to wipe Israel off the map. Fatah is the governing party of the PA, and the closest Palestine has to a "moderate" party, yet it writes in its charter that their goal is the "eradication of Zionist economic, political, military and cultural existence." This enemy has no moral qualms whatsoever, no interest in following international law or basic morality, and is more than willing to target Israel's civilians, use their own civilians as human shields, and use child soldiers like we saw last week in Jenin. Such war crimes are in Palestine's DNA.
Peter is right. In Israel, peace is no longer seen as a reasonable possibility, because everyone in Israel and really across the world knows Palestine doesn't want it. Palestine refused peace offers ten times and has never been able to make peace with any Israeli government, left, right, and center. So, the viewpoint in Israel has turned to "conflict management" or as Peter mentioned "shrinking the conflict." They realize that Palestine will never want peace with Israel and will continue the murdering and war crimes no matter what Israel does, so Israel needs to find methods that "shrink" the conflict, or reduce the violence to as low a level as possible while still recognizing it will never stop entirely. This includes things like lowering the number of checkpoints, but still keeping some of them, and, yes, working with the Palestinian Authority to stop attacks before they happen, like the intervention in Jenin this week. Peter of course hates this idea, because if Palestinians and Israelis aren't actively killing each other, he won't be asked to speak on CNN about how Israel is bad.
I'm not a big fan of the Palestinian Authority either, but I certainly don't have a problem with them stopping terror attacks and reducing the violence. That's probably the least objectionable thing about the PA.
If Peter thinks the current situation is so bad and "apartheid", let's hear him insist on Palestine ceasing the terror attacks and making actual steps towards a lasting peace with Israel. He didn't talk much about actual peace with Israel in his article because he cannot deny Palestine doesn't want it, and if Palestine is to blame for something, that something isn't worth discussing.
I don't understand you seeming to ignore the history of modern Israel. Are you holding a too liberal point of view with regard to the Palestinians? Do you not remember that every time Israel gave up something to them, that the Palestinians promptly carried out attacks against Israel and its citizens? Are you blissfully unaware that the Palestinians have continually chanted "Death to the Israelis!" and "Drive them into the sea" since the nation was formed (and before!)? I'm sure you know that history, so I can't figure out your motivation or your viewpoint. I would love to hear a defense of your position.
Stop calling Israel a colonial regime and the PA a subcontractor…you see Mr Beinart your perspective is a western one that is condescending and alien to the region; before European ideas were introduced by colonial forces like England and France no one thought like you and everything was based on religion, tribe and clan…you, my lettered friend, think everyone thinks like you..THEY DO NOT…Jews are indigenous based on history, archaeology and communal tradition to this land and have always been there and aspired to return. The PA is at fault for not nurturing reconciliation, nation building and security. Stop being a social worker and start being a realist.
Most Palestinians have always and continue to believe in your options 5 and 6. The reason there was no national infrastructure in 1967 territories when Israel defended itself from Jordanian and Egyptian aggression is because those respective areas were controlled by other states-notice how despite being created in 1964/65 no Palestinian nationalist group called for Jordanian and Egyptian expulsion and the creation of a Palestinian state in those areas…
Why does Peter Beinart insist on condescending ly infantilizing the PA and not holding them accountable; the whole idea behind Oslo was for them to make places like Jenin orderly and part of their civil catchment area…if they did that the IDF would not have to act alone. Mr Beinart feels he knows what’s best for the Palestinians-this is a typical form of intellectual colonialism and pandering. Face it: The PA and it’s corrupt, nepotistic and I democratic hierarchy is run like a crime family by a converted Jew who only cares about staying in power by feigning impotence in English and instructing his minions to glorify terrorists, stoke irredentism and spout anti demotic rhetoric in Arabic.
An interesting analysis of the appalling situation that the apartheid Zionist state of Israel is imposing on the Palestinian people. No doubt the Zionists who for some reason (guilt? Who knows?) hang around the comment threads here will reject the clarity of what you wrote and somehow blame Palestinians for having the temerity to live in Israel/Palestine.
Those of us around the world who want to see Palestinians allowed to return and live peacefully in their homeland must stay informed as to the malign intentions of violent Zionism and its followers who, as is miserably and painfully clear, will not stop until they have cleared Israel/Palestine of the last Palestinian. But the Palestinian movement is vigorous and popular, and it has right on its side.
Here in the UK, we can support the excellent and courageous work of Palestine Action which is successfully building local movements of direct action against the Israeli state-owned arms trade and its factories, such as Elbit Systems. The British state has responded by prosecuting these brave people, and they surely need our backing.
Your comment about Israel having expulsion in its DNA is not only Anti Zionist but feeds into the meme in the Arab world of the expansionist and evil “ Jews.” Also, Israel accepted partition in 1948 and where not the ones who closed off The Strait of Tiran and fought as a coalition to throw the Jews in the Sea…Apartheid is also faulty and inappropriate in your thesis…Arab citizens of Israel vote and serve in the Knesset and receive state based civic services and benefits. Further Jews are indigenous to this land while White Europeans were never indigenous to South Africa
Also, you mention Gaza …where are the settlements and lack of a governing authority there…it just goes to show how faulty your logic is; even when there are no Jews and a group controls the territory no reconciliation or peace is possible. By the way you using a Jewish term to describe the celebration of the martyrdom of a “ Shahid(a)” just illustrates your ignorance and ethnocentrism …how would you like it if they called Baruch Goldstein a “ Shahid”?
Israeli Jews and Israeli Druze voters are pushed rightward due to 75 years of non acceptance, idiotic and faulty rhetoric like yours and terror. The Naqba was for the most part caused by Arab aggression and religious and ethnocentric intolerance and chauvinism. What is unthinkable is how you pander to Arabs and hold Israel to a Roberts Rules standard in the Middle East…NO AMOUNT OF SURRENDER AND COLLABORATION WILL MAKE THE PALESTINIAN STREET ACCEPT YOU…WAKE UP AND DEMAND RESPECT THROUGH ACCOUNTABILITY AND STRENGTH
I honestly think that all European and American Jews should be expelled from PALESTINE, especially Americans.
Americans, both Jews and non-J, save for a few level headed like Peter, have emboldened the purported victims of the Holocaust by funding them and supplying them with weapons to steal land and kill the poor, benighted and dark Arabs.
So religious, yet so callous. Thank god I'm atheist.
Stunningly, Gaza is so outside your mind and worldview now that it never even merited a mention as one of the territories occupied in 1967. This also means you missed out on one of the major options left to Israel for the populated Palestinian areas of the West Bank--Gazification: Ghettoize, besiege and throw away the key for decades. Similar to the model that has been applied to the neighborhoods behind the wall in Jerusalem as well. Isn't it more likely that the Jenin op is laying the groundwork for this fate for these West Bank cities?
It's nice to see Beinart dealing with reality for a change. What we often hear from Palestinian apologists is if the two state solution dies or becomes infeasible, a "one state solution" is the only inevitable result. But this is not true, as Beinart admits in this column.
But there is yet another option, one that Beinart didn't think of, which is the Jordanian option:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allon_Plan
Regarding mass expulsions from the West Bank, although this is certainly undesirable, it's not unprecedented as a way of resolving conflicts. Israel and Palestine were not the only example in history of a partition and resulting population transfer. India and Pakistan's creations led to a million dead and many more forced to leave their homes. And of course millions of Germans were expelled from their homes at the end of World War II.
Let's also not forget that the pro-Palestinian activist class are insistent that all 500,000 Israeli settlers be expelled, and of course are big proponents of the "right of return" which would involve 10 million Palestinians leaving their homes and going to Israel. So the idea of mass movement as a prerequisite to end the conflict isn't unprecedented or even undesirable, at least according to Amnesty International, who calls for every settler to be removed from the West Bank.
The real issue, the one that Beinart can't talk about, is that the Palestinians do not want peace with Israel under any circumstances and under any conditions. That's why the Second Intifada "broke out" (aka planned and executed by Arafat so he could maintain his legitimacy after signing the Oslo Accords, any move towards peace with the Yahud makes Palestinian leaders lose legitimacy in the eyes of their people). Let us all hope the Palestinian leadership finally chooses peace and human rights over war and terrorism. The Palestinians have much more to lose from the death of the two state solution than the Israelis.
Peter writes this whole column, and never talks about the elephant in the room: The complete and total refusal by Palestine to live in peace with Israel. Notice that he never gives any agency to any Palestinians in this article. They are never responsible for their own fate and situation, all they do is just live under the conditions imposed on them by Israel and react accordingly.
Israel is faced with a hostile nation, Palestine, that has trained its people for generations at this point to hate Israel and Israelis and Jews. Its only aspiration in life is to wipe Israel off the map. Fatah is the governing party of the PA, and the closest Palestine has to a "moderate" party, yet it writes in its charter that their goal is the "eradication of Zionist economic, political, military and cultural existence." This enemy has no moral qualms whatsoever, no interest in following international law or basic morality, and is more than willing to target Israel's civilians, use their own civilians as human shields, and use child soldiers like we saw last week in Jenin. Such war crimes are in Palestine's DNA.
Peter is right. In Israel, peace is no longer seen as a reasonable possibility, because everyone in Israel and really across the world knows Palestine doesn't want it. Palestine refused peace offers ten times and has never been able to make peace with any Israeli government, left, right, and center. So, the viewpoint in Israel has turned to "conflict management" or as Peter mentioned "shrinking the conflict." They realize that Palestine will never want peace with Israel and will continue the murdering and war crimes no matter what Israel does, so Israel needs to find methods that "shrink" the conflict, or reduce the violence to as low a level as possible while still recognizing it will never stop entirely. This includes things like lowering the number of checkpoints, but still keeping some of them, and, yes, working with the Palestinian Authority to stop attacks before they happen, like the intervention in Jenin this week. Peter of course hates this idea, because if Palestinians and Israelis aren't actively killing each other, he won't be asked to speak on CNN about how Israel is bad.
I'm not a big fan of the Palestinian Authority either, but I certainly don't have a problem with them stopping terror attacks and reducing the violence. That's probably the least objectionable thing about the PA.
If Peter thinks the current situation is so bad and "apartheid", let's hear him insist on Palestine ceasing the terror attacks and making actual steps towards a lasting peace with Israel. He didn't talk much about actual peace with Israel in his article because he cannot deny Palestine doesn't want it, and if Palestine is to blame for something, that something isn't worth discussing.
i'd imagine neighboring countries. I think it's only possible in the context of violence that escalates and continues for a while
I don't understand you seeming to ignore the history of modern Israel. Are you holding a too liberal point of view with regard to the Palestinians? Do you not remember that every time Israel gave up something to them, that the Palestinians promptly carried out attacks against Israel and its citizens? Are you blissfully unaware that the Palestinians have continually chanted "Death to the Israelis!" and "Drive them into the sea" since the nation was formed (and before!)? I'm sure you know that history, so I can't figure out your motivation or your viewpoint. I would love to hear a defense of your position.
Stop calling Israel a colonial regime and the PA a subcontractor…you see Mr Beinart your perspective is a western one that is condescending and alien to the region; before European ideas were introduced by colonial forces like England and France no one thought like you and everything was based on religion, tribe and clan…you, my lettered friend, think everyone thinks like you..THEY DO NOT…Jews are indigenous based on history, archaeology and communal tradition to this land and have always been there and aspired to return. The PA is at fault for not nurturing reconciliation, nation building and security. Stop being a social worker and start being a realist.
Most Palestinians have always and continue to believe in your options 5 and 6. The reason there was no national infrastructure in 1967 territories when Israel defended itself from Jordanian and Egyptian aggression is because those respective areas were controlled by other states-notice how despite being created in 1964/65 no Palestinian nationalist group called for Jordanian and Egyptian expulsion and the creation of a Palestinian state in those areas…
Why does Peter Beinart insist on condescending ly infantilizing the PA and not holding them accountable; the whole idea behind Oslo was for them to make places like Jenin orderly and part of their civil catchment area…if they did that the IDF would not have to act alone. Mr Beinart feels he knows what’s best for the Palestinians-this is a typical form of intellectual colonialism and pandering. Face it: The PA and it’s corrupt, nepotistic and I democratic hierarchy is run like a crime family by a converted Jew who only cares about staying in power by feigning impotence in English and instructing his minions to glorify terrorists, stoke irredentism and spout anti demotic rhetoric in Arabic.
An interesting analysis of the appalling situation that the apartheid Zionist state of Israel is imposing on the Palestinian people. No doubt the Zionists who for some reason (guilt? Who knows?) hang around the comment threads here will reject the clarity of what you wrote and somehow blame Palestinians for having the temerity to live in Israel/Palestine.
Those of us around the world who want to see Palestinians allowed to return and live peacefully in their homeland must stay informed as to the malign intentions of violent Zionism and its followers who, as is miserably and painfully clear, will not stop until they have cleared Israel/Palestine of the last Palestinian. But the Palestinian movement is vigorous and popular, and it has right on its side.
Here in the UK, we can support the excellent and courageous work of Palestine Action which is successfully building local movements of direct action against the Israeli state-owned arms trade and its factories, such as Elbit Systems. The British state has responded by prosecuting these brave people, and they surely need our backing.
Your comment about Israel having expulsion in its DNA is not only Anti Zionist but feeds into the meme in the Arab world of the expansionist and evil “ Jews.” Also, Israel accepted partition in 1948 and where not the ones who closed off The Strait of Tiran and fought as a coalition to throw the Jews in the Sea…Apartheid is also faulty and inappropriate in your thesis…Arab citizens of Israel vote and serve in the Knesset and receive state based civic services and benefits. Further Jews are indigenous to this land while White Europeans were never indigenous to South Africa
Also, you mention Gaza …where are the settlements and lack of a governing authority there…it just goes to show how faulty your logic is; even when there are no Jews and a group controls the territory no reconciliation or peace is possible. By the way you using a Jewish term to describe the celebration of the martyrdom of a “ Shahid(a)” just illustrates your ignorance and ethnocentrism …how would you like it if they called Baruch Goldstein a “ Shahid”?
Spot on! New piece in The Nation today making the same case:
https://www.thenation.com/article/world/masafer-yatta-destruction-palestine-israel/?fbclid=IwAR0mBKVFc-BVlbQMJIfMwBDvFlbFDw93-1RSqW1DCXToNjIrJjKVEKBYfDw
Such an important and timely discussion. In the meantime, we deal on the ground within the Theater of Absurd:
https://sbahour.medium.com/my-clown-is-in-an-israeli-prison-again-2219690a866e?sk=19625ad412fb14f7bbca31c710687a0b
Biden should at least not invite Netanyahu to Washington given he can't do much else
Israeli Jews and Israeli Druze voters are pushed rightward due to 75 years of non acceptance, idiotic and faulty rhetoric like yours and terror. The Naqba was for the most part caused by Arab aggression and religious and ethnocentric intolerance and chauvinism. What is unthinkable is how you pander to Arabs and hold Israel to a Roberts Rules standard in the Middle East…NO AMOUNT OF SURRENDER AND COLLABORATION WILL MAKE THE PALESTINIAN STREET ACCEPT YOU…WAKE UP AND DEMAND RESPECT THROUGH ACCOUNTABILITY AND STRENGTH
I honestly think that all European and American Jews should be expelled from PALESTINE, especially Americans.
Americans, both Jews and non-J, save for a few level headed like Peter, have emboldened the purported victims of the Holocaust by funding them and supplying them with weapons to steal land and kill the poor, benighted and dark Arabs.
So religious, yet so callous. Thank god I'm atheist.
I hope that day comes.
Stunningly, Gaza is so outside your mind and worldview now that it never even merited a mention as one of the territories occupied in 1967. This also means you missed out on one of the major options left to Israel for the populated Palestinian areas of the West Bank--Gazification: Ghettoize, besiege and throw away the key for decades. Similar to the model that has been applied to the neighborhoods behind the wall in Jerusalem as well. Isn't it more likely that the Jenin op is laying the groundwork for this fate for these West Bank cities?